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	<title>Comments on: Three bishops for America in 1870?</title>
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	<description>The Society for Orthodox Christian History in the Americas</description>
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		<title>By: OrthodoxHistory.org » Blog Archive &#187; Three bishops for America in 1870?</title>
		<link>http://orthodoxhistory.org/2009/10/30/three-bishops-for-america-in-1870/comment-page-1/#comment-1301</link>
		<dc:creator>OrthodoxHistory.org » Blog Archive &#187; Three bishops for America in 1870?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Feb 2011 13:51:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orthodoxhistory.org/?p=1163#comment-1301</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] This article was originally published on October 30, 2009. [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] This article was originally published on October 30, 2009. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Isa Almisry</title>
		<link>http://orthodoxhistory.org/2009/10/30/three-bishops-for-america-in-1870/comment-page-1/#comment-274</link>
		<dc:creator>Isa Almisry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Nov 2009 00:56:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orthodoxhistory.org/?p=1163#comment-274</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Some odds and ends on Fr. Bjerring:

Early on Fr. Bjerring is mentioned serving the needs of the diplomatic corps in Washington (c. 1871) &quot;The marriage of Mr. Kleon Rangabe Greek Minister at Washington, to Miss Dorothea Gerolt, daughter of Baron Gerolt, Prussian Minister at Washington, was solemnized in the Greek chapel, at the residence of the Rev. Father Nicolas Bjerring, the pastor of the Greeks in New York. The little chapel was lighted with wax tapers, and there were only preseot the immediate relatives and friends of the bride and bridegroom. Among these were the Russian Minister at Washington, Mr. Catacazy, and Mr. Botazzi, Greek Consul in New York. &quot;
http://books.google.ro/books?id=o2wYAAAAYAAJ&amp;pg=PA278&amp;dq=Christian+Marriage+Bjerring&amp;hl=en#v=onepage&amp;q=&amp;f=false

A NY Times article of March 14, 1881 mentions in passing that &quot;There is no Greek Chapel in Washington, and the service [for the murdered Czar] will doubtless be held at the residence of the Russian Minister,&quot; &quot;the telegram also directing [the consul general] to start for Washington with Father Bjerring to atttend commemorative services, which will probably be held tommorrow.
http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?res=9505E2D6123FEE3ABC4C52DFB566838A699FDE
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=9505E2D6123FEE3ABC4C52DFB566838A699FDE

During the Centennial Exposition, through Fr. Bjerring, Henry C. Dane brought it to Pres. Grant&#039;s attention that the Ottoman Empire could not afford to pay 
http://books.google.com/books?id=nQstPeWppxsC&amp;pg=PA158&amp;dq=Nicolas+Bjerring&amp;lr=#v=onepage&amp;q=&amp;f=false

Fr. Bjerring wasn&#039;t just limited to the religious sphere, among other things he represented the American Geographical Society, as shown in a US Senate Report:
http://books.google.com/books?id=w1cUAAAAYAAJ&amp;pg=PR52&amp;dq=Bjerring+American+Geographical&amp;lr=#v=onepage&amp;q=Bjerring%20American%20Geographical&amp;f=false

to give an idea of the standing Fr. Bjerring had at the time.

I&#039;ve come across litterature about &quot;Fr.&quot; Honcharenko, which makes him the catalyst for Fr. Bjerring&#039;s chapel, the Greeks being obliged to cut all ties to the Ukrainian.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Some odds and ends on Fr. Bjerring:</p>
<p>Early on Fr. Bjerring is mentioned serving the needs of the diplomatic corps in Washington (c. 1871) &#8220;The marriage of Mr. Kleon Rangabe Greek Minister at Washington, to Miss Dorothea Gerolt, daughter of Baron Gerolt, Prussian Minister at Washington, was solemnized in the Greek chapel, at the residence of the Rev. Father Nicolas Bjerring, the pastor of the Greeks in New York. The little chapel was lighted with wax tapers, and there were only preseot the immediate relatives and friends of the bride and bridegroom. Among these were the Russian Minister at Washington, Mr. Catacazy, and Mr. Botazzi, Greek Consul in New York. &#8221;<br />
<a href="http://books.google.ro/books?id=o2wYAAAAYAAJ&#038;pg=PA278&#038;dq=Christian+Marriage+Bjerring&#038;hl=en#v=onepage&#038;q=&#038;f=false" rel="nofollow">http://books.google.ro/books?id=o2wYAAAAYAAJ&#038;pg=PA278&#038;dq=Christian+Marriage+Bjerring&#038;hl=en#v=onepage&#038;q=&#038;f=false</a></p>
<p>A NY Times article of March 14, 1881 mentions in passing that &#8220;There is no Greek Chapel in Washington, and the service [for the murdered Czar] will doubtless be held at the residence of the Russian Minister,&#8221; &#8220;the telegram also directing [the consul general] to start for Washington with Father Bjerring to atttend commemorative services, which will probably be held tommorrow.<br />
<a href="http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?res=9505E2D6123FEE3ABC4C52DFB566838A699FDE" rel="nofollow">http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?res=9505E2D6123FEE3ABC4C52DFB566838A699FDE</a><br />
<a href="http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=9505E2D6123FEE3ABC4C52DFB566838A699FDE" rel="nofollow">http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=9505E2D6123FEE3ABC4C52DFB566838A699FDE</a></p>
<p>During the Centennial Exposition, through Fr. Bjerring, Henry C. Dane brought it to Pres. Grant&#8217;s attention that the Ottoman Empire could not afford to pay<br />
<a href="http://books.google.com/books?id=nQstPeWppxsC&#038;pg=PA158&#038;dq=Nicolas+Bjerring&#038;lr=#v=onepage&#038;q=&#038;f=false" rel="nofollow">http://books.google.com/books?id=nQstPeWppxsC&#038;pg=PA158&#038;dq=Nicolas+Bjerring&#038;lr=#v=onepage&#038;q=&#038;f=false</a></p>
<p>Fr. Bjerring wasn&#8217;t just limited to the religious sphere, among other things he represented the American Geographical Society, as shown in a US Senate Report:<br />
<a href="http://books.google.com/books?id=w1cUAAAAYAAJ&#038;pg=PR52&#038;dq=Bjerring+American+Geographical&#038;lr=#v=onepage&#038;q=Bjerring%20American%20Geographical&#038;f=false" rel="nofollow">http://books.google.com/books?id=w1cUAAAAYAAJ&#038;pg=PR52&#038;dq=Bjerring+American+Geographical&#038;lr=#v=onepage&#038;q=Bjerring%20American%20Geographical&#038;f=false</a></p>
<p>to give an idea of the standing Fr. Bjerring had at the time.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve come across litterature about &#8220;Fr.&#8221; Honcharenko, which makes him the catalyst for Fr. Bjerring&#8217;s chapel, the Greeks being obliged to cut all ties to the Ukrainian.</p>
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		<title>By: Fr. Oliver Herbel</title>
		<link>http://orthodoxhistory.org/2009/10/30/three-bishops-for-america-in-1870/comment-page-1/#comment-271</link>
		<dc:creator>Fr. Oliver Herbel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Nov 2009 15:45:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orthodoxhistory.org/?p=1163#comment-271</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Isa,

Bjerring apparently converted while in Europe, at least according to Fr. David Abramtsov.  I have no reason to doubt him and it makes sense of the very real situation you note.  Would the son of a prominent city official not have been raised in the Protestant church at the time?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Isa,</p>
<p>Bjerring apparently converted while in Europe, at least according to Fr. David Abramtsov.  I have no reason to doubt him and it makes sense of the very real situation you note.  Would the son of a prominent city official not have been raised in the Protestant church at the time?</p>
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		<title>By: Isa Almisry</title>
		<link>http://orthodoxhistory.org/2009/10/30/three-bishops-for-america-in-1870/comment-page-1/#comment-270</link>
		<dc:creator>Isa Almisry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Oct 2009 20:08:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orthodoxhistory.org/?p=1163#comment-270</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;I have yet to see any hard evidence of a parish in Galveston before the 1890s. I’m sure there were some Orthodox Christians in the city, since it was a major port, but I don’t think there was a parish or a priest before the 1890s. I’ve searched several old Galveston newspapers, with no success&quot;

Exactly my point. I&#039;ve seen the parish mentioned often, and as early as Burgess (1913), yet not mentioned in the NY Times article &quot;Greeks in America&quot; of 8/4/1873 (which mentions the New Orleans Church and what must be the beginnings of the OCA Holy Trinity in San Francisco, but only mentions a Greek newspaper subscriber in Galveston). As for the consuls, yes, it is an interesting question in light of what followed. I am also wondering how much the intermarriage of the Russian Imperial and Greek royal families had to do with attitudes on the matter.


&lt;small&gt;[This comment has Fr. Andrew&#039;s avatar next to it because he accidentally first deleted it instead of approving it.  Apologies!]&lt;/small&gt;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I have yet to see any hard evidence of a parish in Galveston before the 1890s. I’m sure there were some Orthodox Christians in the city, since it was a major port, but I don’t think there was a parish or a priest before the 1890s. I’ve searched several old Galveston newspapers, with no success&#8221;</p>
<p>Exactly my point. I&#8217;ve seen the parish mentioned often, and as early as Burgess (1913), yet not mentioned in the NY Times article &#8220;Greeks in America&#8221; of 8/4/1873 (which mentions the New Orleans Church and what must be the beginnings of the OCA Holy Trinity in San Francisco, but only mentions a Greek newspaper subscriber in Galveston). As for the consuls, yes, it is an interesting question in light of what followed. I am also wondering how much the intermarriage of the Russian Imperial and Greek royal families had to do with attitudes on the matter.</p>
<p><small>[This comment has Fr. Andrew's avatar next to it because he accidentally first deleted it instead of approving it.  Apologies!]</small></p>
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		<title>By: Matthew Namee</title>
		<link>http://orthodoxhistory.org/2009/10/30/three-bishops-for-america-in-1870/comment-page-1/#comment-268</link>
		<dc:creator>Matthew Namee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Oct 2009 17:38:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orthodoxhistory.org/?p=1163#comment-268</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Just to respond to a couple of your points, Isa:

I have yet to see any hard evidence of a parish in Galveston before the 1890s. I&#039;m sure there were some Orthodox Christians in the city, since it was a major port, but I don&#039;t think there was a parish or a priest before the 1890s. I&#039;ve searched several old Galveston newspapers, with no success.

On Greek officials attending Bjerring&#039;s Russian chapel, I would point out that the opposite happened in the early 1890s: Russian officials attended the Greek churches in New York City until 1895, when a Russian church (St. Nicholas) was established. (I&#039;ve written about this in earlier posts.) Bjerring&#039;s chapel, and then the Greek churches, were the only shows in town.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just to respond to a couple of your points, Isa:</p>
<p>I have yet to see any hard evidence of a parish in Galveston before the 1890s. I&#8217;m sure there were some Orthodox Christians in the city, since it was a major port, but I don&#8217;t think there was a parish or a priest before the 1890s. I&#8217;ve searched several old Galveston newspapers, with no success.</p>
<p>On Greek officials attending Bjerring&#8217;s Russian chapel, I would point out that the opposite happened in the early 1890s: Russian officials attended the Greek churches in New York City until 1895, when a Russian church (St. Nicholas) was established. (I&#8217;ve written about this in earlier posts.) Bjerring&#8217;s chapel, and then the Greek churches, were the only shows in town.</p>
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		<title>By: Isa Almisry</title>
		<link>http://orthodoxhistory.org/2009/10/30/three-bishops-for-america-in-1870/comment-page-1/#comment-267</link>
		<dc:creator>Isa Almisry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Oct 2009 15:30:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orthodoxhistory.org/?p=1163#comment-267</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Speaking of American Newspapers and Orthodox Plans, a NYT article &quot;THE RUSSO-GREEK CHAPEL.; A Princely Gift from Russia A Noble Lady of the Imperial Household the Donor An Elaborate and Gorgeous Specimen of Embroidery.&quot; May 15, 1871, mentions in passing &quot;It is Father BJERRING&#039;s wish that it be generally known that the Greek Chapel is a private chapel of the Russian and Greek Legations, and is not open for public worship....there is ordinarily no sermon, and there will not be until the occupation of the new church to be built on Lexington-avenue, plans, &amp;c., for which are expected in a few days.  The chaplain, however, cordially invites any orderly and respectable lady or gentlemen...&quot;
http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?_r=1&amp;res=9807E7DF1639EF34BC4D52DFB366838A669FDE

Given the involvement of the Church of Greece via the consulates, there may be something in the Greek embassy about these plans.  It also raises questions about the later Greek claims vis-a-via Russian jurisdiction.  It is worthy to note that the Greek consul in San Francisco was also involved with the Russian mission there.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Speaking of American Newspapers and Orthodox Plans, a NYT article &#8220;THE RUSSO-GREEK CHAPEL.; A Princely Gift from Russia A Noble Lady of the Imperial Household the Donor An Elaborate and Gorgeous Specimen of Embroidery.&#8221; May 15, 1871, mentions in passing &#8220;It is Father BJERRING&#8217;s wish that it be generally known that the Greek Chapel is a private chapel of the Russian and Greek Legations, and is not open for public worship&#8230;.there is ordinarily no sermon, and there will not be until the occupation of the new church to be built on Lexington-avenue, plans, &amp;c., for which are expected in a few days.  The chaplain, however, cordially invites any orderly and respectable lady or gentlemen&#8230;&#8221;<br />
<a href="http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?_r=1&#038;res=9807E7DF1639EF34BC4D52DFB366838A669FDE" rel="nofollow">http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?_r=1&#038;res=9807E7DF1639EF34BC4D52DFB366838A669FDE</a></p>
<p>Given the involvement of the Church of Greece via the consulates, there may be something in the Greek embassy about these plans.  It also raises questions about the later Greek claims vis-a-via Russian jurisdiction.  It is worthy to note that the Greek consul in San Francisco was also involved with the Russian mission there.</p>
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		<title>By: Isa Almisry</title>
		<link>http://orthodoxhistory.org/2009/10/30/three-bishops-for-america-in-1870/comment-page-1/#comment-266</link>
		<dc:creator>Isa Almisry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Oct 2009 14:53:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orthodoxhistory.org/?p=1163#comment-266</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;In the comments, Isa Almisry asked, quite reasonably, if I had documentation for this.&quot;

Just to be clear, I had not the slightest doubt you had the goods.  Just being such a creature of the University of Chicago, I&#039;m OC on primary sources, and wanted you to share. :)

Which, the ones you have provided, I find most interesting.  That New Orleans is mentioned may have something to do with the mystery of the New Orleans Gospel Book. Flake’s Bulletin of Galveston, Texas (8/20) is also interesting: one would think that something would be mentioned about SS Constantine and Helen there, which also claims a hoary past.  What was its status then?

It is also very interesting that after the sale of Alaska, we see a rush to build up an American Orthodox Church of Americans, such that bishoprics are offered to those whose main qualification seems to be that they were US citizens.

There might be some information in the OCA archives, if St. Petersburg thought to discuss the matter with those on the ground so to speak.  But, as you say, it was a time of transition and maybe the Holy Governing Synod saw no need (that might explain the mixup about Fr. Bjerring&#039;s marital status). That Bishop Popov passed through NYC to return to Russia and supposedly consecrated the Bjerring Chapel may be connected.

I doubt anything remains in the Russian embassy, as the Soviets would probably have little use for such records.  St. Petersburg I expect would, and there might be something at Moscow, where at the time St. Innocent had taken up that see.  But you are right, the American newspapers have too much correct for it to be just their speculation.  And I am sure that they knew nothing of St. Innocent&#039;s recommendations which dove tail with the 1870 plan (or could it be great minds think alike?).

Btw, I&#039;ve always wondered how Bjerring, a native of Denmark, had been baptized by the Vatican and not the state Lutheran Church (at the time, the Absolutist Constitution of Denmark (the only formal one the Age of Absolutism produced) had only two articles it mandated as unamendable, the absolute power of the king and the  Augsburg Confession as the creed of the State.

This would support the idea that the Russian Church had seen itself as the Orthodox jurisdiction in North America at least (or at least the US).  The question then becomes what of the reaction in NYC about the Greek chapels from the Russian Consul at the time.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;In the comments, Isa Almisry asked, quite reasonably, if I had documentation for this.&#8221;</p>
<p>Just to be clear, I had not the slightest doubt you had the goods.  Just being such a creature of the University of Chicago, I&#8217;m OC on primary sources, and wanted you to share. <img src='http://orthodoxhistory.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Which, the ones you have provided, I find most interesting.  That New Orleans is mentioned may have something to do with the mystery of the New Orleans Gospel Book. Flake’s Bulletin of Galveston, Texas (8/20) is also interesting: one would think that something would be mentioned about SS Constantine and Helen there, which also claims a hoary past.  What was its status then?</p>
<p>It is also very interesting that after the sale of Alaska, we see a rush to build up an American Orthodox Church of Americans, such that bishoprics are offered to those whose main qualification seems to be that they were US citizens.</p>
<p>There might be some information in the OCA archives, if St. Petersburg thought to discuss the matter with those on the ground so to speak.  But, as you say, it was a time of transition and maybe the Holy Governing Synod saw no need (that might explain the mixup about Fr. Bjerring&#8217;s marital status). That Bishop Popov passed through NYC to return to Russia and supposedly consecrated the Bjerring Chapel may be connected.</p>
<p>I doubt anything remains in the Russian embassy, as the Soviets would probably have little use for such records.  St. Petersburg I expect would, and there might be something at Moscow, where at the time St. Innocent had taken up that see.  But you are right, the American newspapers have too much correct for it to be just their speculation.  And I am sure that they knew nothing of St. Innocent&#8217;s recommendations which dove tail with the 1870 plan (or could it be great minds think alike?).</p>
<p>Btw, I&#8217;ve always wondered how Bjerring, a native of Denmark, had been baptized by the Vatican and not the state Lutheran Church (at the time, the Absolutist Constitution of Denmark (the only formal one the Age of Absolutism produced) had only two articles it mandated as unamendable, the absolute power of the king and the  Augsburg Confession as the creed of the State.</p>
<p>This would support the idea that the Russian Church had seen itself as the Orthodox jurisdiction in North America at least (or at least the US).  The question then becomes what of the reaction in NYC about the Greek chapels from the Russian Consul at the time.</p>
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